Topic started by Raj (@ hydrec2.hyd.deshaw.com) on Sat Jan 30 04:20:19 EST 1999.
All times in EST +10:30 for IST.
Under the prevailing acrimony, this would be the last topic that would seem to invite attention.
But then, I thought it is only fair enough we explore this avenue, too. In this forum, i have seen IR-bashing, ARR-bashing, Deva-bashing etc. but no MSV-bashing. Thought might as wel "Sindu-mudinjify".
Before you pounce on me as a blind IR-fan trying to bring down a great genisus(MSV), let me state my utmost reverence for MSV as a composer. Infact, I dont think there are too many copied songs by him. That shouldn't , however, prevent us from searching for such specimen.
In searching for a song that would trigger off this discussion, I had to dig deep. Finally I came up with one, what's more, I even have MSV's opinion regarding that song and it's original:
Remember "Sun mere bandhu re.." from Sujatha..great boat-man song of SDB.
The opening strains of "Thazhaiyam poo mudichu.." from Bagapirivinai sound too dangerously close to it. Actually, I would not have been smart enough to find it. But MSV himself pointed out the similarity in an interview and claiemd it as "great minds think alike"..!
His claim was that he had composed that song one fine day and the next day, he happens to go to a hindi movie and what does he hear but his own composition!!
Now, we have to take his word for it but I cant take it without a pinch of salt:). As sherlock holmes would say "I dont believe in dangerously close co-incidences".
Are there any copied songs by MSV at all?
- Old responses
- From: Udhaya (@ 18.104.22.168)
on: Mon Feb 8 15:30:28 EST 1999
Are you talking about Creedence Clearwater Revival? I'm familiar with all their popular hits, would like to know which specific song you are referring to.
- From: IR_MSV_Battle_fanatic (@ elroy.cs.wisc.edu)
on: Mon Feb 8 18:00:13 EST 1999
Some djhk... stuff:-
Here's a method to convert this also to an IR-MSV fans' battle
Didn't you know that MSV used the time machine to go to the future and copied IR's tunes?
IR is the source of all TFM - no doubt about it!!!
- From: anandaum (@ 22.214.171.124)
on: Tue Feb 9 01:13:18 EST 1999
Is yenmanathu ondruthan is by MSV if it is, it is copied!
- From: raju (@ pcthnt231.lgu.ac.uk)
on: Tue Feb 9 08:23:20 EST 1999
can u print the CCR song please. I want 2 compare it.
- From: Santhoji (@ )
on: Wed Sep 6 20:21:56 EDT 2000
Hello All, This message is slightly (??) out of topic. Does anyone know of a website that has lyrics to old tamizh songs especially, Ival Senthamizh Thenmozhiyaal from Malayitta Mangai. Thank you.
- From: haris (@ 126.96.36.199)
on: Wed Sep 6 22:29:23 EDT 2000
pArtha gnAbagam illayO = hAl kaisA hai janAb kA...
- From: Karthik S (@ 188.8.131.52)
on: Fri Sep 8 00:04:34 EDT 2000
The en manathu ondru thaan is inspired from Beethoven's composition Bagatelle in A minor WoO59, popularly called Fur Elise, written by him in 1810. And yes, this tune has been immortalized by car back-up music, telephone in-waiting music and so on!
paartha nyabagam illaya is NOT hal kaisa hai janab ka. NO further comments on this! :-)
Someone mentioned kallazhagar and its WC composition and credited it to deva! I thot Kallazhagar had music by IR!
anubavam pudhumai is inspired (not a direct lift at all) from an Italian song Besame Mucho (meaning Kiss me more). Its a good example of creative inspiration when you compare both tunes head on.
paartha nyabagm illayo is inspired from a famous old song 'sway with me' - a direct lift. Lemme get back with more details on sway with me.
- From: vijay (@ 184.108.40.206)
on: Fri Sep 8 02:26:09 EDT 2000
Kallazhagar is indeed one of the rarest good works not to mention original(atleast so far;))
works of Deva.
- From: RV (@ 220.127.116.11)
on: Fri Sep 15 02:32:31 EDT 2000
There is a recent release by HMV called "Legends - MSV-TKR". MSV talks about Thazhaiyam Poo Mudicchu in vol 2 of that series. His words approximately.
All folk songs - Tamil, Telugu, Bengali, Malayalam, Assamese - share a common base and similarities can be perceived in all such songs. One such folk tune is the (Here he sings the prelude thannana thana thane of the song). This is a folk tune from Moplahs of Kerala. When we hear this, the tune evokes a kid sitting on a buffalo and taking care of it. (Madu meikkum paiyan). When we went to Russia, I wanted to sing this and everybody said "Madu meikkara pattukku needhan layakku" and let me sing. (Chuckles). It was well appreciated. When SDB heard this, he said that he has used this too. Whether I copied from him or he copied from me is a different matter - it just goes to prove that folk songs all over India share a common base.
Also, we used only 4 instruments in this song. We hv used 40 instruments, 100, 150 - but irrespective of the number of instruments, it is the melody that is important in the song.
P. Leela is the female voice. She knew me from the days when I was earning a salary of 70 rupees. Even though she has sung several songs before this under my baton, this song is special and she ensured that both she and I succeeded in this song.
- From: sk (@ 18.104.22.168)
on: Fri Sep 15 03:49:54 EDT 2000
It is a great song! The article below says it slightly differently..
looks like the humming was lifted from the hindi movie 'Sujatha'.
Was this the SD Burman movie referred to by MSV?
The link for the article (need murasu anjal):
The song in real audio:
- From: G.Ragavan (@ 22.214.171.124)
on: Fri Sep 15 06:30:46 EDT 2000
Do u all know the movie "Naalai Namathey"?
MSV refused to score music for that movie first.
No one refused to score music for MGR movies.
But he did. There was a reason behind that. He was
afraid that he'll be asked to reuse the hindi tunes of Original Version "Yado Ki Barat".
Only when it was assured by MGR not to reuse the tunes, he agreed and scored. None of the songs had resemblence of Hindi movie songs.
The same hindi movie was remade in Telugu with NTR with same old hindi tunes.
Remember the movie Aradhana. The Tamil version "Sivakamiyin Chelvan" didn't use the hindi tunes or styles.
But some hindi MD was friend of MSV. He is no more alive. He had some understanding to use MSVs tunes.
Do anybody know that MD?
But some songs were copied under compulsion. like,
1. Chenthamiz then moziyaal By Kannadasan
2. Anupavam Puthumai By Sridhar
3. En manathu onruthaan By ?
The hero presents a dancing doll that gives the same tune and the heroine goes to dream with the same tune "En manathu onruthaan".
- From: G.Ragavan (@ 126.96.36.199)
on: Fri Sep 15 06:36:46 EDT 2000
One more question.
Is there any anti-MSV gang (like ARR fans are anti IR and IR fans are anti ARR)?
- From: RV (@ 188.8.131.52)
on: Sat Sep 16 12:58:38 EDT 2000
MSV refers to remakes from one language to another in the same vol 2. His words approximately.
Generally, whenever I was asked to do the music for a hit Hindi movie, I always felt a reluctance, fear and so on. I hv done it for several movies though. Yadon Ki Barat was remade in Tamil under my baton. Brahmachari was remade as Enga Mama. But I always felt a reluctance to do that as there will always be some comments that the music is not as good as the original.
Once this situation was reversed. Among the Hindi MDs, Naushad is a demigod to me. Naushad was asked to do the remake of Palum Pazhamum. After seeing the movie, Naushad told Sridhar and Venus Krishnamoorthy that it is difficult to replace the Visu's music content in the movie. Apparently Naushad used to call him Visu. Not only that, Naushad wrote to MSV saying that MSV has given spellbinding music in the movie and he has reservations about taking the music director's mantle for the remake.
Naushad was persuaded to work on the remake. When he met MSV, he said that he has replaced almost all songs and he feels that his version (which was not copied) has come out reasonably well. But he couldnt replace "Naan Pesa Ninaippadhellam". He said that he has done it under the shadow of MSV. (in Tamil - "Unga Nizhaliliye adhai panni irukken.") Such a great MD saying that!
When I saw the remake, I was so ashamed of my inadequacy compared to him that I didnt even touch my harmonium for 3 days.
What is the song in Hindi? Is it "Yeh Kon Aaya Roshan Ho Gayi Mehfil"?
- From: MS (@ 184.108.40.206)
on: Sat Sep 16 13:32:21 EDT 2000
It is really heartening to this write - up. What an attitude and mutual respect!
- From: Balaji (@ 220.127.116.11)
on: Sat Sep 16 17:42:32 EDT 2000
It is the beautiful number "Mera Pyaar be thu hai"
Listen to the Interludes... Really great Mirudhangams...
I think Naushad shuould be proud of this song!
- From: pennathur (@ 18.104.22.168)
on: Sun Sep 17 02:52:10 EDT 2000
When will we hear an MV unplugged? The man with just his harmonium and a guitar from IR, and a table from Deva, with ARR on the piano.
The man's voice is glorious. Even now he can make your hair stand on end. His song in Sangamam was awesome. Some months back I heard "Ennakku oru vidivalli..." from that movie starring Sivaji, Sarita, Sarat Babu, Jaishankar. Stunning.
Ikkaraikku akkarai pachai and of course the oustanding, siva sambo from ninaitaale inikkum.
MSV is a supremely modest man with a great sense of humor and is absoultely unpretentious. Long live MSV!!!!!!!!!!
- From: haris (@ 22.214.171.124)
on: Sun Sep 17 20:59:01 EDT 2000
what is the name of the hindi movie, which is the remake of 'paalum pazhamum'??
- From: SL (@ 126.96.36.199)
on: Mon Sep 18 01:42:21 EDT 2000
haris, the movie is 'Saathi' starring Rajendra 'Jubilee' Kumar and Vyjayanthimala. The song MSV was referring to is 'Mera pyaar bi thoo hai' sung by Mukesh and Lata, a good number not a great number.
- From: Karthik S (@ 188.8.131.52)
on: Mon Sep 18 07:56:01 EDT 2000
doesnt 'mera pyaar bhi tu hai' sound a lot like Nusrat's 'kinna sohna tenu rab ne banaya'? I think similar raagam!
- From: Karthik S (@ 184.108.40.206)
on: Mon Sep 18 07:58:31 EDT 2000
doesnt 'mera pyaar bhi tu hai' sound a lot like Nusrat's 'kinna sohna tenu rab ne banaya' and 'punnai vanathu kuyile nee' (its a IR song, forgot which movie, I think it stars Karthik)? I think similar raagam!
PS: can anybody tell me which movie is this 'punnai vanathu' song from? Lovely song.
- From: anonymous (@ 220.127.116.11)
on: Mon Sep 18 11:46:04 EDT 2000
It is muththuk kaaLai
- From: Hailie (@ )
on: Tue May 7 12:55:29 EDT 2002
I search the Lyrics from a song called 'Yadon Ki Barat' It's from an indian movie about three brothers, a family drama.
- From: music-fan (@ 18.104.22.168)
on: Tue May 7 16:04:45 EDT 2002
MSV I believe composed 'Yaar siritthal enna' by PBS inspired on 'Yaduna Jaaye beete dilonki' by Rafi picturised on Rajendra kumar. Don't remember the movie.
- From: eden (@ 22.214.171.124)
on: Wed May 8 01:19:25 EDT 2002
who's the MD for the song `en kAdhal vAzhkayilE' or something like that which has lines `Eh manamE pAdu...' that resembles an ABBA song? Is it MSV? (I don't remember the ABBA song, will post after searching the cassette / CD)
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